Why cultivating agency matters more than cultivating skills in the AI era | Max Schoening (Head of Product, Notion)
🤖 AI Summary
Overview
This episode explores how AI is reshaping product development, the importance of cultivating agency over skills, and the core principles behind building successful products. Max Schoening, Head of Product at Notion, shares insights on empowering teams, the evolving role of software, and the future of work in an AI-driven world.
Notable Quotes
- One day you wake up and realize the world is made up by people no smarter than you. It just really awakens you to the idea that you can change things.
— Max Schoening, on cultivating agency.
- All the great products have one tiny core that is so exceptional. Adding more features never works.
— Max Schoening, on the essence of great product design.
- We already have universal basic income. It’s called knowledge work.
— Max Schoening, on the privilege of modern work.
🧠 Cultivating Agency in the AI Era
- Max emphasizes that agency—the belief that you can shape the world—is more critical than technical skills in thriving amidst AI advancements.
- He highlights examples of high-agency individuals at Notion who redefine their roles, such as designers learning to code and PMs prototyping directly in code.
- Advice for building agency: Start by making things, even small projects, to realize the malleability of the world around you.
⚙️ The Changing Landscape of Product Development
- The first 10% of any project is now free
due to AI tools, enabling rapid prototyping and exploration. However, the last 10%—polishing and scaling—remains the hardest.
- Max advocates for demos, not memos,
encouraging teams to iterate through tangible prototypes rather than lengthy documentation.
- He predicts a shift toward more general-purpose tools, akin to 1990s software like spreadsheets and word processors, but enhanced with AI.
🌟 The Tiny Core
Theory of Great Products
- Great products succeed by excelling at one tiny, exceptional core feature:
- iPhone: Multi-touch.
- GitHub: Pull requests.
- Notion: Blocks and slash commands.
- Dropbox: Seamless file syncing.
- Adding more features to compensate for a weak core is a common pitfall. Instead, focus on refining the core experience.
🛠️ Malleable Software and the SaaS Future
- Max champions malleable software,
where users can adapt tools to their needs, contrasting with rigid, pre-defined apps.
- He argues that the SaaS apocalypse is overstated; while AI enables custom tools, most users prefer the convenience and maintenance of SaaS solutions.
- Notion’s success with AI stems from its connected workspace, which provides rich context for agents to operate effectively.
🎨 Building Taste and Quality in Products
- Taste is developed through iterations and feedback, much like training a model. Exposure to high-quality work and diverse tools also sharpens taste.
- Max laments the decline in software quality despite the explosion of software quantity, calling for a return to Apple-esque
craftsmanship.
- He stresses the importance of consolidating features into a cohesive core rather than proliferating disconnected functionalities.
AI-generated content may not be accurate or complete and should not be relied upon as a sole source of truth.
📋 Episode Description
Max Schoening is head of product at Notion, where he’s been especially effective at getting designers and PMs to ship code, prototype in the terminal, and launch extremely successful AI products. He was previously a PM at Google, ran design at Heroku, was VP of Design (and a part-time engineer) at GitHub, and is a two-time founder. He’s one of the most AI-forward product leaders out there and one of the deepest thinkers on how AI changes how we build and use software.
We discuss:
1. What’s most worked in getting designers and PMs to embrace AI
2. Why agency—not skills—is the thing that separates people who thrive from those who fall behind
3. How the first 10% of every project is now “free,” and what that means for product development
4. Max’s “tiny core” theory of great products: iPhone multitouch, the GitHub pull request, Notion blocks, Dropbox’s menu bar icon
5. Why the SaaSpocalypse is overstated
6. Why the amount of software has exploded but the quality hasn’t, and why that gap creates opportunity
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Episode transcript: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/why-cultivating-agency-matters-more
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Archive of all Lenny's Podcast transcripts: https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fo/yxi4s2w998p1gvtpu4193/AMdNPR8AOw0lMklwtnC0TrQ?rlkey=j06x0nipoti519e0xgm23zsn9&st=ahz0fj11&dl=0
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Where to find Max Schoening:
• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/max-schoening
• Website: https://max.dev
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Where to find Lenny:
• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com
• X: https://twitter.com/lennysan
• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/
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In this episode, we cover