#2338 - Beth Shapiro

Overview

Beth Shapiro, an evolutionary molecular biologist and Chief Science Officer at Colossal Biosciences, discusses the groundbreaking work of de-extinction, ancient DNA research, and the ethical and scientific implications of bringing back extinct species. The conversation spans her personal journey, the challenges of academia, and the future of genetic engineering.

Notable Quotes

- We are as gods... we just better get good at it. - Beth Shapiro, on humanity's role in shaping ecosystems through technology.

- It's just so strange to see an animal in the flesh that didn’t exist for ten thousand years. - Joe Rogan, reflecting on seeing Colossal's direwolves.

- If we decide not to allow ourselves the space to figure out what we can do with these technologies, we’re still making a decision—and that decision has consequences. - Beth Shapiro, on the risks of avoiding innovation.

🧬 Ancient DNA and De-Extinction

- Beth Shapiro explains her work in paleogenomics, extracting DNA from ancient specimens to rewrite evolutionary narratives.

- Colossal Biosciences has successfully engineered direwolves by modifying gray wolf DNA with traits from ancient direwolf genomes.

- The process involves identifying key genetic traits, such as coat color and size, and using CRISPR technology to replicate them.

- Shapiro emphasizes the ethical considerations, stating that Colossal avoids working on humans or species that cannot consent, like Neanderthals.

🦣 Mammoths, Direwolves, and Beyond

- Colossal’s projects include resurrecting the woolly mammoth, thylacine (Tasmanian tiger), and dodo, with plans to reintroduce them into controlled environments.

- Mammoths could help restore Arctic ecosystems by trampling snow and promoting grasslands, but their rewilding will be carefully monitored.

- Shapiro teases the possibility of bringing back other extinct megafauna, such as the Irish elk and longhorned bison, while acknowledging the complexities of reintroducing predators like saber-toothed cats.

🐾 The Ethics and Challenges of Genetic Engineering

- Shapiro addresses criticisms of playing God, arguing that humans have long manipulated nature through domestication and conservation.

- She highlights the potential of genetic engineering to combat extinction, such as making Hawaiian honeycreepers resistant to avian malaria or helping coral adapt to climate change.

- The conversation touches on the risks of invasive species and the importance of rigorous ecological planning before rewilding.

🌍 Academia, Scarcity Mindset, and Innovation

- Shapiro critiques the negativity and gatekeeping in academia, where competition for funding stifles collaboration and innovation.

- She recounts her own experiences with skepticism and resistance, particularly in the field of ancient DNA.

- Joe Rogan and Shapiro discuss the broader implications of scientific progress, including the role of AI in analyzing ecological impacts and the ethical dilemmas of genetic enhancement.

🐻 Bigfoot, Bears, and Evolutionary Mysteries

- The podcast delves into cryptozoology, with Rogan speculating that Bigfoot sightings could be misidentified bears walking upright.

- Shapiro shares insights into extinct species like the short-faced bear and giant sloth, marveling at their evolutionary adaptations.

- The discussion underscores how ancient DNA and fossil records continually challenge assumptions about human and animal history.